Episode 6: Scaling for Success | Ken McLachlan

Ken McLachlan (00:00):

In 1986, what was important then isn’t as important. Now they kept evolving it on it, but it was really focused on who I am, who I surround myself with, and what I wanted this company and my own personal view to represent.

Chris Cook (00:23):

Today, I am joined by somebody that not only shaped one of the most successful brokerages in real estate, but who’s done it with integrity, intention, and heart. Ken McLachlan is a partner at RE/MAX Hallmark, one of the largestRE/MAX brokerages in the world, actually the largestRE/MAX brokerage in the world. In this episode, we talk about what it really means to lead, not just in title, but also in action. Ken shares how delegation trust and clarity of purpose helped him build something meaningful, and most importantly, scalable. We also unpack what it takes to be proactive in a reactive business, how to make partnerships work, and why success starts with showing up. Let’s get into it. Alright. All right. Ken McLachlan, this is an all time highlight for me having, I’ve got the boss on the line here.

Ken McLachlan (01:18):

I Well, you have me here. I know that

Chris Cook (01:22):

Deb’s somewhere.

Ken McLachlan (01:23):

Deb is somewhere. Yeah, I’m here. Yeah, it great to see you, Chris.

Chris Cook (01:27):

Yeah, great to see you too. So a little bit of a different sort of approach to maybe some of the podcasts that you do where you really dive in and you get a lot of the personal stuff, and maybe we end up getting

Ken McLachlan (01:41):

There.

Chris Cook (01:42):

But this podcast is really about helping people with their businesses specifically. And you actually, you called me out and you’re like, why aren’t I on there? I happen to know a thing or two about this, and it really, yeah. What better guest to have than somebody that has the largest one of the owners of the largest RE/MAX brokerage in the world? And I think the first thing I would want to do is to start off and to ask you, did you set out to have this sort of business?

Ken McLachlan (02:27):

That’s a good question. I didn’t set out to have the biggest RE/MAX in the world. That wasn’t my stated goal. I did set out to have the sort of business that we’ve developed. Yeah, I did. From an early stage of this whole thing, I was quite clear on what I wanted the company to represent and be. And I was quite clear that the elements within that company, I knew what they were. But to answer your question, do I have a goal of becoming the biggest and most productive and blah, blah, blah, never. I don’t work that way.

Chris Cook (03:08):

Right. Yeah. I can’t say how glad I am actually that you said that because there’s so many people that I’ve had already on on the show. And one of the things that we really talk about is the importance of actually planning about knowing where you’re going. And maybe it’s not to say I’m going to be the biggest of the best, but to have a really clear idea of what it is that you want to deliver and then let the success sort of follow that.

Ken McLachlan (03:34):

Yeah. Well, I kind of grew into it though, Chris. I knew exactly how I wanted it framed, but I grew into, as I got into this business after 40 plus years of knowing, it kept evolving into different things. So I knew exactly I wanted it to represent things that were important to me. And at the time, in 1986, what was important then isn’t as important Now they kept evolving it on it, but it was really focused on who I am, who I surround myself with, and what I wanted this company in my own personal view to represent always. I didn’t want it to become something that I wasn’t proud of. I didn’t want it to become something that didn’t echo who I am in life. And that was the importance. I knew that from day one, though, I knew that I had to live my life, my business in congruent to who I am as a person.

Chris Cook (04:39):

I gotcha. When you started this, tell us a little bit about who did you start this with and how did that evolve?

Ken McLachlan (04:49):

Well, I came from 86. I came, I joined re max. There were 53 people in the company at the time. There was a new office they just opened up at paper in Danforth. I came from a small brokerage, independent Terry Martel, loved it. And I was there for six years with Terry and become, if not the number one, consistently near the number one with that company. I wasn’t,

Chris Cook (05:20):

That’s a selling agent, right?

Ken McLachlan (05:22):

Yeah. It was always a selling agent. And then I understood that I recognize and a lot of deep respect for Terry in the changing times. I recognized that he wasn’t really engaged as much as I thought he should be at the time. So I recognized that if I was going to continue with that company and the leader wasn’t engaged, it’s going to be a negative for me. So I was searching out different, and RE/MAX was new at the time, evolving, and I wanted really to stretch myself. I wanted to take chances, I wanted to grow. And I thought that being involved with Remix at the time was the thing they did and was for me. So I started as an agent and three years later, 19, I guess 1988, 89, I got tired of it. I got burnt out, and a lot of us do, and this business can burn the hell out of you.

(06:23):

It really can really beat you up. And so I’ve experienced that in 89 and I decided that I didn’t want to, I always tell people that if I had to go through one through hall plan again to show a house, I would kill myself figuratively. And I didn’t want to do that. I didn’t want to. And real estate was much different back then. We didn’t have teams, we didn’t have as many systems and things in place. It was just to show people and less people basically is all we did. And I said that I don’t want to do it. I want to get an ownership. I just said that I just want to get an ownership. I’m going to do it. I didn’t know what it meant. I didn’t have any money at all. I just knew that I didn’t want to be a sales rep.

(07:09):

And I made the decision to find out how I could do that. So I went around to different companies and surprisingly, I got three offers to be owners, two offers with other companies outside of RE/MAX, and I didn’t have any money. It was really strange. They said, come on board, be an owner with us. You don’t have to give us any money and you own half the company and you’ll be blah, blah, blah. And I thought, well, that’s kind of strange. And then I went back to RE/MAX and I said, this is what I’m going to do. And they says, well, of year thought of owning RE/MAX Hallmark. And I, frankly, I hadn’t at all. And so we were able to put together a deal, but I became a 25% owner. So for the next four or five years, I learned how to switch my way of being from a sales rep into leadership, my natural leadership style. So at that time, I was a problem solve. I would be the guy that would sit in the office and I would sit there and people would walk in and they tell me their problems. They bitch to me about something, they would whatever. And I would solve the problems, and that’s all. I got my juice every day.

Chris Cook (08:27):

So it took you four or five years to figure that all out?

Ken McLachlan (08:34):

No, it took longer than that, but I think I started developing what was getting in my way within that first four or five years. So I was the management style. So the best thing I ever did within that four or five years I believe, was I gave up my desk. I thought, I don’t have to be, if I’m in this office, I’m being reactive to everything. My highest and best use was to go out and meet people, to help people grow their business, meet other people, to grow our company. And I couldn’t do that sitting behind that desk. So I gave up my desk and was the best thing I ever did. I got out, became proactive. Well, every day I went to see people, I caused things to happen. I visited people, whatever. And to this day, I still don’t have an office. And that’s what, 40 years ago.

(09:24):

And that was a big key to me. I think we get, for me, I got too hung up on what I thought the role of a leader was, which isn’t anything to do with that, the role of a leader. My way of thinking is to be proactive, to cause things to happen, to problem solving in a sense, but by proactively doing something. And what I was doing for the first two or three years was sitting back and being reactive and problem solving and being a nice guy. And once they shifted that around, magic happened on that stage. So

Chris Cook (09:59):

Do you think that what you’re talking about there and sort of getting out and being more proactive versus just waiting for things to happen to you, do you think that, is that translatable to agents right now, do you think? I,

Ken McLachlan (10:12):

No question. I think it’s one of the biggest things that gets in their way is they allow other things to create their day for them rather than create your own day. And I mean, listen, we all have distractions. We all have things that have to be looked after. But I think we get ourself, a lot of agents that I see get, and I was guilty of it as well, or self worth by having people in phone, us solving a problem and moving forward rather than causing new business to happen. See, I recognize really early that my main function as a leader was to cause things to happen. And I think agents have to live their life businesslike, causing things to happen, causing business to happen, causing clients to come their way, causing activity to go out there. So yeah, I think it’s really important to agents to do that.

(11:07):

Proactively. We do these coaching with people agents, and one of the things we do, Chris, is we have them for a week or two weeks track everything they do hour by hour, you get up at seven, what do you do from seven to eight, eight to nine, blah, blah, blah for two weeks straight. And then we look at that, we rate them the activity as proactive or reactive. And most of the, typically they’re reactive. And typically the agents would spend maybe 10 hours a week working by proactive work if they spent 10 hours proactively working by causing business to happen. It’s a good thing to out there, but it’s difficult. And listen, I was guilty of it, there’s no question. But if you were to ask me what was the thing that helped me get a focus on what I was doing was recognizing that and really being clear on what mattered to me or getting it in my own

Chris Cook (12:05):

Way. Did you find when you were doing that, let me back up for a second. First of all, thanks for that. As you know, I do a lot of coaching at Prem RE/MAX Hallmark. It’s one of the things, I actually do a task audit, but the one thing I haven’t done yet, and I’m going to start doing it, is actually looking at what’s proactive and what’s reactive. I have agents rank what they like doing one, two, and three. Three being they dislike it and one, they really love doing it, but it allows me to get a snapshot. But thanks for that because I’m going to use that. That’s really

Ken McLachlan (12:40):

Valuable. And I think the other thing to add on to that, the proactive work, I have people come to me and say, well, I have to contact more people. I don’t like door locking. I don’t like whatever it is. Or phone calls or we’re not saying don’t do it there. Do what you like doing. That causes business to happen. So there’s going to be something that you really like and you really good. If you like it, you’re going to be good at it. And that causes business to happen. So if it doesn’t cause business to happen, it’s not a proactive business activity for you. So I knew very early as an agent that I wasn’t keen on cold calling. I hated it. I did not. And I used to say that if I had to build my business on cold calling, I’d be out of business.

(13:29):

I wouldn’t do this work. So what I did is I focused on, a lot of this stuff was database work I did was very, very good with my database. I understood them. There’s a lot of micromarketing with that and that’s a different story. But I focused on my database looking after my people. I wanted, what I thought in my head, Chris, was that when someone, if you owned a house and something happened or was related to that house, the first thought I wanted you to have in your head was Kevin Lockman. So how can I solve this problem? Ken Lock had the answer for me. So I positioned my database, all the people I knew in there to reach to me for, help them with their house, mortgaging, plumber, kitchen architect, whatever, it doesn’t matter, selling or referral work. So that’s what I did and I built all my business on that and that’s how I developed it.

Chris Cook (14:23):

And I think at the end of the day, and I can attest to this being one of your clients there for a number of years, is I think there’s a genuine care that comes along with that as well. I’ve only met a few people in my life that have the scope of people that, and the depth of how much you know about people. I’ve never seen you at a loss for someone’s name personally. I mean it’s limited, but I’ve seen you engage with people at deep level every time there’s a homework event or something like that.

Ken McLachlan (15:06):

You know what, I needed to say something. I don’t know why I know this, but from an early age in this business, if I meet somebody I hadn’t seen for a while, I can go back to an instant incident that happened. So I know that if I see you, I can relate, I can have a conversation to you about what we talked about two years ago, and I can remember that incident or conversation points a bit and I can relate to that. So I always kept, I think it is very important to have a keen interest in people. They do care. I do care about what their life is like. I do care what they’re doing. I did care what they’re achieving and I did care about any chuckles they’re having.

Chris Cook (15:52):

Yeah, certainly it helps to build that database when that’s where you’re coming from. Alright, so let’s get back on the business side of things here, because you said you got out from behind the desk and you started doing more proactive things, but this business has a lot of reactive, essential parts of it that is reactive. I mean, obviously you must have outsourced that. You must have delegated, you must have had other people within the brokerage dynamic of employees that were taking that stuff off your plate. How did that transition go for you?

Ken McLachlan (16:33):

Well, I was at one point, I was the guy that would s shovel the walk, answer the phones, change the toilet paper, blah, blah, blah. Nobody could do it better than me. Nobody could handle anything. I was a problem solver, did all that. And then a lot of the stuff I had came from Strategic Coach, a great program by Dan Sullivan here in Toronto that I took for probably five years. Really, really good at it. Again, a lot of things are timing in life, and this was a great timing period for me to do the Strategic Coach. And it taught me about my unique value. It taught me about delegation, it taught me about giving up my desk, that type of thing in my office. So I realized that I had to, in order for me to do what my unique ability was every day in growing in the company and being of service to people, I had to not do the stuff that a lot of other people could do and know that I could pay people to do.

(17:37):

So I had to give up the ownership of not being the problem solver or the guy that could do things. So over time, I had people in my life that do stuff, so I would delegate everything. I would be in the position where I knew that if I wouldn’t touch things that weren’t in my unique ability stage of what I needed to do, so anything came up that somebody else could do better or somebody could do for me, I would delegate that off. I would say, listen, why don’t you phone Tanya? Why don’t you have, listen, I used to have my assistant, Tanya make all my appointments for me. I used to have everything done. I didn’t want to touch anything other than sitting down with Chris Cook in dealing with him was my unique ability. That was the best thing I could do for my time.

(18:30):

I enjoyed the most, I had fun doing and it caused great results. So everything else I just pushed away and I trusted people to handle that and if they could handle it, which they did, I was very grateful for that. So allowed me to grow, allowed me to do other things, allowed me to connect with people, allowed me to get out and about and see other people and do that. So it really was freeing for me. And if you can’t delegate, it’s a real problem. I mean, you’re getting in your own way if you can’t learn to delegate and it doesn’t isn’t something that you learn overnight. You have to baby set the whole thing really and delegate the whole thing off and trust people to do it and not worry if they screw up. Life screwing up is a good thing. I tell people that they screw up. That means they’re learning something. They’re good for you. You’ve learned something. Now next time we do this, we won’t have that problem, so let’s move forward. So I delegate everything now. I don’t touch anything I don’t want to touch ever. I don’t care what it is.

Chris Cook (19:29):

The hard part I think is delegating with a more purpose. If I’m going to give something to somebody and expect them to do it at a high level, then I need to give them the tools to be able to do that. And that was my first mistake. A couple of times I made hires and I expected them to figure it out. And it was really interesting when my assistant that I have now Olga, I gave her a lot of tools to be successful in the job and she was able to take those and grow the position. That was a really big game changer for me. And understanding, yes, if you’re going to delegate and you expect somebody to thrive in that position, then you’ve got to give them that sort of starting point.

Ken McLachlan (20:24):

Well, you have to trust them and you have to give ’em the tools, which you said, and you have to trust them and you have to understand that they’re going to make mistakes as well. And that’s okay to do that because they’re freeing you up from the stuff that you can do. Listen, I make a lot of mistakes too. I would probably do the same mistake they’re going to make.

Chris Cook (20:41):

Well, not anymore. You don’t make mistakes anymore.

Ken McLachlan (20:43):

No, not anymore. But he used to make a lot. Well, you know what? I think it’s just a matter of trusting them and doing it. I always tell people that, listen, I’ve had five or six or seven different assistants in my life. I can guarantee that every one of them, the next one has been embedded within the one previous. And I always thought the one that I had at the time was exceptional. So were always put me in a different level, put me in a different level, did this and that. Then they got more stuff. The one who runs my life now, basically I is Tanya and there’s nobody better than her at all ever will be because she’s really understands me, knows what’s going on, and knows the company really well. So it’s a matter of the delegation of what do I need to know? Usually when things come to me, it is because people need a second opinion or it’s critical. And if it isn’t a second opinion or critical, I don’t know about it and I don’t want to know about it, doesn’t matter.

Chris Cook (21:46):

I would hazard a guess that while Tanya is amazing and I would agree, I’ve had the privilege of interacting with her a few times, there’s a strong chance that you’ve gotten a lot better too. And those things go hand in hand, right?

Ken McLachlan (22:00):

Yeah. You have to keep growing, have to keep, I’ve had to keep growing. Part of my DNA is always to be engaged and to involve people in my life that I want to be involved with. And if I’m not engaged, I shouldn’t be doing what I’m doing. I don’t get out of it completely. And so I’ve grown all the time. How I am today isn’t what I was like a year or two years ago and a year from now, it won’t be the same. It’ll be good for, I have a new capability. I always tell people, one of the goals I have every year is that layer a new capability into my life. It doesn’t have to be about I’m going to be whatever, some years I have, I’m going to be a learn how to scuba dive, or this year I’m doing Tai Chi or I’m doing meditation one year. So it’s always different layers on top of who I am every year. And that gives me more depth, more understanding, and it makes them more interesting as well. And I think that’s what we should be doing with our real estate careers as well. Always adding layers to who we are, not to congregate life, but to make it more interesting, more engaging and more fulfilling.

Chris Cook (23:14):

I think it’s an opportunity to do a little retroactive of our conversation so far, and I couldn’t agree more, but to get those layers. I think sometimes people, because they’re not delegating the business good ideas that we’re working get under the carpet because of the newest, latest, greatest idea. It doesn’t mean necessarily that it’s wrong, but if you’re going to grow your business and layer up, it doesn’t mean that you have to get rid of that old thing maybe. Yeah, I don’t think you should. The only way that I can continue to grow and develop is because I have support in the ways that matter. The next part, the thing that I’m probably the most interested to talk to you about, because it’s something personally I have the least experience with is partnership. Because you have two partners in RE/MAX Hallmark. How did they come to be? How did it, because what you’ve said so far is you had a partner or you came in as a partner and now you have

Ken McLachlan (24:30):

Yeah, I don’t think I’ve ever been without a partner anything. When I was a real estate agent, I remember I had a partner for about three years when I first started as well, just doing that. So I think partnerships are very difficult. They can be very difficult. They important. I think if you can leverage a partnership, the have people that are not like you, that are very, how they approach business is different than you. I think that’s important to recognize. I was fortunate in the people in my life, my partners are, they have the Integrity Foundation I have and the ambition I have, but their way of doing it is much different than I do. They can do it much better than I could do certain things. Steve, as an example, is exceptional with operations in a lot of things. But let’s just pick on operations for now.

(25:33):

I’m not very good at that. I have no interest in that. I mean, I have a superficial, the big picture issue on that, but I’m not really that interested in it. So that’s his thing. Deborah is more factual, A, B, C. She’s exceptional at what she does In recruiting and growing this company. I tend to do the macro and overlook the whole thing like that. And that’s what I do well. So these partners in my life have added to me the ability for me to be more complete in what I do. And I would tell people if they’re getting a partnership, number one, why are they doing that? What’s observing? What’s their purpose in having a partnership? So often it’s just that they want to, I often hear from people, they all want to take more time off. Well, that’s kind of silly because that never happens, but so my partnerships are always strategic in the way that it was going to allow me to be better on who I am in business.

(26:32):

So every partner I’ve ever had has made me a better person. And the other thing I was taught very young in this business was that if you’re in a partnership, you want them to have more than you have. And if you can’t have that attitude, you shouldn’t have a partner. So my attitude was always the partners I have, I want them to have more than I have. I want them to get the for sharing hotel or Airbnb. I want them to have the better bedroom. I want them to have the better car. I want them to have the, I don’t want that. I want my partners to have the abundance of being in my relationship. And if you haven’t got that attitude with partners, I don’t think it’s the right attitude to have. You have that attitude and that type of thing. The abundance of having an abundant partnership where you want them to have more and all my partners want me to have more. That’s so it kind of works out that way.

Chris Cook (27:29):

Yeah, it’s probably how it’s a marriage. It’s a marriage.

Ken McLachlan (27:37):

No, yeah, it is a marriage. And in a sense it’s just really the communication’s important and like-minded goals. You know what really you want them to have everything they want in their life. And if I help you get you Ziglar, I help enough people to get, if I help enough people get what they want, I’ll get everything I want in my life. And that’s a partnership, I think. So our partnership’s difficult. I’ve had to help people get out of partnerships because I don’t think they were based on a good foundation. But if you have a good foundation partnership, I think they’re incredible. Really good. I’m very fortunate. All my partners have been tremendous.

Chris Cook (28:22):

I think. I mean, it is not to say that you can’t find success by yourself, but do you think you would’ve got where you are without partners?

Ken McLachlan (28:31):

Not at not at chats. I would hate to do this alone today. Even I couldn’t have done it along. I grew because of my partners. And to answer your question, no, I wouldn’t have. I see it’s a lonely business. I can be very lonely business not, and I think the luckiest guy in the world, I got the partners I have and the partners I’ve had as well. So I could never be where I am without that.

Chris Cook (29:04):

Yeah, I’m looking forward to actually probably talking to some more about this with you because I agree it’s an interesting business that we spend as much time with people as we do, and it is lonely as it is. Yeah, it’s very lonely. It’s a bit of a conundrum because I always thought, and I think actually my wife probably thinks, I spend all day talking to people, why are you lonely?

Ken McLachlan (29:32):

Well, it can be a very lonely business. It’s a very insecure business for a lot of people. You’re only as good as your next deal,

(29:41):

But I’m telling you, there’s no better business than we’re in, I believe. I believe this business is incredible opportunity. Every day is a new opportunity for us. I don’t care what the market is like, I don’t care who you’re dealing with. I don’t care what the interest rates are like it doesn’t matter. This is an incredible business to be in. I get to work with people every day and help them grow themselves and help them grow their business and help them buy or sell real estate. And guess what? I don’t have to buy the real estate to help them. I don’t have to buy the stock as a real estate agent. It’s incredible. And it pays well if you’re good at it. It does. Yeah. If you’re good at it

Chris Cook (30:23):

On a deal to deal basis, yes, it does

Ken McLachlan (30:25):

Pay well and it’s difficult. It’s a difficult business. But you know what? If you’re true to it, you work hard and you develop it. It’s tremendous business to be in opportunity to live your life in service of people. And to be me owning a real estate brokerage is how lucky am I

Chris Cook (30:46):

Should

Ken McLachlan (30:47):

It being. I have 2000 agents, 200 plus staff, a great leadership team, a history of 40 plus years of doing this, and wow, I just pinched myself how incredible it is.

Chris Cook (31:03):

And

Ken McLachlan (31:04):

It started from just, I get to be myself

Chris Cook (31:09):

Really. And you do a good job at that too. I would say that last question. You’ve been doing this, like you said, you’ve had this path now for over 40 years. Where do you think the business is going in terms of all the things that we’ve talked about, delegation, outsourcing, connectivity with people, like the people part of the business. There’s a lot of tech that’s coming in. Where do you think that we’re going to go in the next five to 10 years with this?

Ken McLachlan (31:41):

I don’t think fundamentally the business has changed that much. I think the business will keep evolving. There would be more distractions with AI and the newest invite us, the rico, nor whatever the rules are changing as you are. But that’s always been changing. It’s always been evolving. So I don’t think basis of this business is much different than it was when I started years and years ago. And of course, there’s new things that have happened and there’s new ways of doing things. I know that. But the reality is, if when I look at people that are really engaged and successful in this business and make a difference, the one thing that Kate’s popping up for me, Chris, is this, is they have in their life the discipline to actually show up. And every one of them I see is that they do things differently. They may connect with people differently, but the bottom line, they all have this common thread, which is the discipline of showing up every day and doing it and making sure that they’re providing a great service to people.

(32:57):

And that’s what we did in 1979 and 1985 and 1995 and 2025. It’s the discipline of showing up for work. Now. There’s going to be different ways of the business will evolve that maybe it’s going to be maybe more people. Many things going to change. There’ll be probably fewer. I think there’ll be fewer people in this business. I think unless you’re really centered on what you’re doing, it’s a difficult business to be in. And the failure rate is quite high, and that’s always been that way. But I think the people that have the discipline that are out there working it every day, and the passion for it and the commitment and the focus on it, I think the future is very bright and I think it’s very bright for people that are committed to doing the work. The question, so answer your question, five, 10 years from now, there’s certainly going to be different strategies on how to do real estate and different formulas and different things, but there will still be the people that are succeeding in this business. And the main reason they’re succeeding is because they have the discipline to do it.

Chris Cook (34:09):

Amazing. I can’t think of a better way to end it than talking about the future and how things, as much as they change, they stay the same.

Ken McLachlan (34:19):

Ats

Chris Cook (34:19):

Great. The core of that, and it’s encouraging, I think for people that are in the business that are doing the work that they’re not going to be,

Ken McLachlan (34:27):

Well get rid of the distractions. Get rid of the distractions, get to work, and the things we put in our head about that stop us from achieving the goals we want in our life and the reasons we want to achieve that goals are important too. So get out of your way and do it.

Chris Cook (34:45):

Amazing. Thank you so much for your time, Ken.

Ken McLachlan (34:48):

You’ve been great buddy. Thank you. I appreciate you asking me, even though I hinted on it.

Chris Cook (34:56):

What a gift to have Ken McLachlan on the show, honest, generous, and full of wisdom from four decades in the business, from building strong partnerships to stepping out from behind the desk. Ken’s story is a reminder that success doesn’t come from doing it all. It comes from doing what matters. If this conversation resonated with you, please take a moment to leave a rating and a review whenever you listen. And if you found value in this episode, I’d be grateful if you shared it with just one friend. It makes a huge difference. Thanks for listening to Mind Your Real Estate business. We’ll see you next time.